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   <front>
      <journal-meta>
         <journal-id journal-id-type="DOAJ">15041611</journal-id>
         <journal-title-group>
            <journal-title>Voices: A World Forum for Music Therapy</journal-title>
         </journal-title-group>
         <issn>1504-1611</issn>
         <publisher>
            <publisher-name>GAMUT - Grieg Academy Music Therapy Research Centre (NORCE &amp;
               University of Bergen)</publisher-name>
         </publisher>
      </journal-meta>
      <article-meta>
         <article-id pub-id-type="doi">10.15845/voices.v20i1.2871</article-id>
         <article-categories>
            <subj-group subj-group-type="heading">
               <subject>Interviews</subject>
            </subj-group>
         </article-categories>
         <title-group>
            <article-title>The History, Current Role, and Future of Music Therapy in
               India</article-title>
            <subtitle>International Interviews with Prof. Dr. Sumathy Sundar and Aastha
               Luthra</subtitle>
         </title-group>
         <contrib-group>
            <contrib contrib-type="author">
               <name>
                  <surname>Hicks</surname>
                  <given-names>Jennifer</given-names>
               </name>
               <xref ref-type="aff" rid="J_Hicks"/>
               <address>
                  <email>jhicks@joyfulnoisesllc.com</email>
               </address>
            </contrib>
         </contrib-group>
         <aff id="J_Hicks"><label>1</label>Joyful Noises LLC &amp; American Music Therapy
            Association (AMTA)</aff>
         <contrib-group>
            <contrib contrib-type="editor">
               <name>
                  <surname>McFerran</surname>
                  <given-names>Katrina Skewes</given-names>
               </name>
            </contrib>
         </contrib-group>
         <pub-date pub-type="pub">
            <day>1</day>
            <month>3</month>
            <year>2020</year>
         </pub-date>
         <volume>20</volume>
         <issue>1</issue>
         <history>
            <date date-type="received">
               <day>27</day>
               <month>6</month>
               <year>2019</year>
            </date>
            <date date-type="accepted">
               <day>9</day>
               <month>1</month>
               <year>2020</year>
            </date>
         </history>
         <permissions>
            <copyright-statement>Copyright: 2020 The Author(s)</copyright-statement>
            <copyright-year>2020</copyright-year>
            <license license-type="open-access"
               xlink:href="http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/">
               <license-p>This is an open-access article distributed under the terms of the
                     <uri>http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/</uri>, which permits
                  unrestricted use, distribution, and reproduction in any medium, provided the
                  original work is properly cited.</license-p>
            </license>
         </permissions>
         <self-uri xlink:href="https://dx.doi.org/10.15845/voices.v20i1.2871"
            >https://dx.doi.org/10.15845/voices.v20i1.2871</self-uri>
         <abstract>
            <p>This paper is based on an assignment conducted for a graduate music therapy course
               which included interviews with Prof. Dr. Sumathy Sundar and Aastha Luthra, both music
               therapists currently practicing in India. It is a compilation of personal
               communications and writings from Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra, with some additional
               background from Dr. Sangeeta Swamy, on the history, current role, and future of music
               therapy in India. This paper acknowledges the effects of colonization; outlines
               current music therapy educational practices, theoretical orientations, methods,
               instruments, populations, and settings; honors the cultural diversity of this complex
               country; and highlights the personal role that music can also play for music
               therapists. In addition, this paper seeks to increase the dialogue regarding both the
               challenges and sources of hope in building the future of music therapy in India.</p>
         </abstract>
         <kwd-group kwd-group-type="author-generated">
            <kwd>music therapy</kwd>
            <kwd>India</kwd>
            <kwd>interview</kwd>
         </kwd-group>
      </article-meta>
   </front>
   <body>
      <!-- sec lvl 2 begin -->
      <sec>
         <title>Interview Submission</title>
         <p>“Be open to learning music therapy from your colleagues all over the world. There is so
            much exciting happening within this young field. Each region has something unique to
            offer. There are similarities, and all programs operate within a global framework.
            However, the art side is different. Learn and enjoy its complexity” (S. Sundar, personal communication, October 23,
               2018).</p>
         <p>This paper is based on an assignment completed in the fall of 2018 for a graduate music
            therapy course at Augsburg University in Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA, which included
            interviews via email with Prof. Dr. Sumathy Sundar and Aastha Luthra, both music
            therapists currently practicing in India. It is a compilation of personal communications
            and writings from Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra, with some additional background from Dr.
            Sangeeta Swamy, on the history, current role, and future of music therapy in India. It
            acknowledges the effects of colonization; outlines current music therapy educational
            practices, theoretical orientations, methods, instruments, populations, and settings;
            honors the cultural diversity of this complex country; and highlights the personal role
            that music can also play for music therapists. In addition, this paper seeks to increase
            the dialogue regarding both the challenges and sources of hope in building the future of
            music therapy in India.</p>
         <p>While this is my paper and my perspective, it is not my own culture. As an experienced
            and registered yoga teacher as well as a board-certified music therapist, I have sought
            to learn about the history of yoga in South Asia and to integrate it into my personal
            and professional practices in a culturally respectful and humble manner. As part of that
            journey, I have added meaning to the assignments for my graduate degree (such as this
            international interview) by using them to delve more deeply into this topic. I believe
            that it is essential for me to acknowledge that I share Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra’s
            responses through my own individual lens as a White, Norwegian/German/Danish cisgender
            female from the United States. I believe that it is vital for us all to continue
            exploring the critical issue of appropriation and will do my best throughout this paper
            to detail the history, current role, and future of music therapy in India in ways that
            respect and honor the traditions from which this practice has evolved. With that said,
            any errors are mine alone, and you are always welcome to reach out to me at
               <uri>jhicks@joyfulnoisesllc.com</uri> with any concerns or corrections.</p>
      </sec>
      <!-- sec lvl 2 end -->
      <!-- sec lvl 2 begin -->
      <sec>
         <title>Past</title>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 begin -->
         <sec>
            <title>Colonization in India</title>
            <p>Because India has been repeatedly invaded and colonized by other countries during the
               past 400 years, it is vital to acknowledge the effects of colonization in order to
               understand and effectively work with and learn from the perspectives of individuals
               from India. In particular, the British colonization, from the mid-18th through
               mid-20th centuries, has had a pervasive influence on the diverse culture of this
               country. During this period of colonization, Indian farmers were heavily taxed, which
               Swamy (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">2017</xref>) informed us “[depleted] the
               country of resources such as spices, teas, and textiles and [contributed] to famines
               and mass starvation. Christian missionaries also unsuccessfully attempted a mass
               conversion of Indians to Christianity and created schools taught only in English” (p.
               66).</p>
            <p>Many years of nonviolent resistance and civil disobedience led by Mahatma Gandhi
               finally resulted in India being granted its independence in 1947. Unfortunately, the
               British had also instigated violent conflict between Hindus and Muslims, which led to
               “partition” and the division of India into the separate countries now known as India,
               Pakistan, and Bangladesh (formerly West and East Pakistan). This resulted in forced
               migration, the loss of property, and even more animosity between individuals from
               these cultures. The effects of this period of colonization continue to resonate
               within the extended families of Indians today, influencing everything from language
               to the economy to music (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017</xref>).</p>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Music in India</title>
               <p>Luthra brought up India’s history of colonization when describing how music was
                  used in her country’s fight for freedom. As she noted, “In India, there has always
                  been a culture of creating a change through music.” (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22, 2018).</p>
               <p>In addition, music and chanting have been and continue to be essential parts of
                  most Indian religions. Ancient Hindu texts describe using hymns for healing
                  illness, and singing and listening to sacred hymns are thought to provide
                  spiritual healing and improve mental health according to Islamic belief (<xref
                     ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017</xref>). Both Prof. Dr. Sundar (S. Sundar, personal communication, October 23,
                     2018) and Swamy (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">2017</xref>) noted
                  that certain ragas, discussed in further detail below, are even believed to “bring
                  cure, enhance mood, and serve as a medium of prayer to seek health from god”
                     (S. Sundar, personal communication, October
                     23, 2018.</p>
               <p>Furthermore, “Indian traditional systems of health and healing also include
                  various musical treatment approaches” (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2007">Sundar,
                     2007, p. 397</xref>). One of the most commonly known traditional Indian healing
                  practices is Ayurveda. Swamy (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">2017</xref>)
                  explained that Ayurveda means “the science of life” (p. 76) and originated in
                  India around 500 B.C. Its roots are in Hinduism, and its focus is on promoting
                  healing by “balancing the doshas or elements that make up the body, known as vata
                  (air), pitta (fire), and kapha (water and earth)” (<xref ref-type="bibr"
                     rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017, p. 76</xref>). Its practices are so integrated into
                  everyday life that many are used without identifying them as such, for example
                  using certain herbs or spices as home remedies (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017"
                     >Swamy, 2017</xref>). Ayurveda also includes the use of music to help balance
                  the doshas. It is just one of the examples of the ways that sound and music have
                  been used for thousands of years to promote healing in India (<xref
                     ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017</xref>).</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
         </sec>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 end -->
         <!-- sec lvl 3 begin -->
         <sec>
            <title>Music Therapy in India</title>
            <p>Despite the importance of music in India, music therapy as a profession and clinical
               discipline is still in its developmental stages (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017"
                  >Swamy, 2017</xref>). The Indian Association of Professional Music Therapists was
               founded in 2011, with only approximately 10 professional members and two schools
               noted as of 2013 (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="WFMT2013">World Federation of Music
                  Therapy [WFMT], 2013</xref>). In December of 2018, the Indian Music Therapy
               Association (IMTA) was founded</p>
            <disp-quote>
               <p>to propagate Music Therapy as a medical intervention, to make a professional forum
                  for the working Music Therapists of India, to enlarge the research and education
                  of Music Therapy in India, and to make people aware of the therapeutic impact of
                  music with the help of volunteers and other professionals. (<xref ref-type="bibr"
                     rid="WFMT2019">WFMT, 2019, para. 5</xref>)</p>
            </disp-quote>
            <p>The most recent WFMT Fact Page (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="WFMT2019">2019</xref>)
               lists approximately 50 professionals now practicing in India as well as three schools
               offering certification and one school offering a graduate degree program.</p>
            <p>While you will see some similarities related to their original interest and
               experiences in music, Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra have had very different music
               therapy journeys, which have led them to diverse music therapy practices. This made
               interviewing both of them particularly interesting. Just as the experience of one
               music therapist in the United States of America would not fully encompass the
               totality of music therapy in the USA, the experience of one music therapist (or even
               two music therapists) in India does not fully encompass the totality of music therapy
               in that country either.</p>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Prof. Dr. Sundar’s Journey</title>
               <p>Prof. Dr. Sundar has master’s degrees in Carnatic music and applied psychology
                  with a specialization in clinical psychology (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="SM2013"
                     >Sundar &amp; Millet, 2013</xref>). She learned about music therapy while
                  completing her doctorate in “musical interventions in cancer care” (LinkedIn,
                  n.d.). It was only at that point that she learned the difference between music for
                  healing, music medicine, and music therapy. Her passion was instrumental in
                  increasing her understanding of how music can heal and in “understanding modern
                  science through ancient wisdom” (S. Sundar,
                     personal communication, October 23, 2018).</p>
               <p>At that time, formal training in music therapy was not available in India.
                  Therefore, Prof. Dr. Sundar’s music therapy education was primarily self-directed,
                  as she used textbooks, international conferences, and technology to learn all she
                  could about music therapy and to assimilate this knowledge into her previous
                  background in music and psychology (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="SM2013">Sundar
                     &amp; Millet, 2013</xref>). She shared,</p>
               <disp-quote>
                  <p>As I was not formally educated in music therapy, the learning was in a long and
                     circuitous way. There were a lot of challenges in learning music therapy all by
                     oneself. It was not easy at all. I had to understand music therapy by
                     integrating bits and pieces of information I collected from various resources.
                        (S. Sundar, personal communication,
                        October 23, 2018)</p>
               </disp-quote>
               <p>Prof. Dr. Sundar cofounded the Nada Centre for Music Therapy in 2004 and was a
                  founding board member of the International Association for Music and Medicine. She
                  has served for more than 10 years for the WFMT, first as their Regional Liaison
                  for South East Asia and currently as their Education and Training Commission
                  Chair. Her current positions as Professor of Music Therapy and Director of the
                  Center for Music Therapy Education and Research at Sri Balaji Vidyapeeth, a health
                  sciences university based in Pondicherry, will be discussed further below.</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Luthra’s Journey</title>
               <p>Luthra began singing under professional supervision at the age of two and a half
                  and holds a Master’s degree in Hindustani Classical Vocal Music.</p>
               <p>However, Luthra was also interested in how music can change “the dimensions of
                  human mechanism” (A. Luthra, personal
                     communication, October 22, 2018). Like Prof. Dr. Sundar, Luthra started
                  her own self-directed search by reading Indian books on how music can make a
                  difference in people’s lives. While she found references to “music as a healing
                  object” (A. Luthra, personal communication,
                     October 22, 2018), she wanted to go deeper into understanding this
                  concept. That is when she learned about music therapy. By this time, Luthra had
                  options for her training and chose to go to The Music Therapy Trust, which offers
                  a Post Graduate Diploma in Clinical Music Therapy (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22, 2018; <xref
                     ref-type="bibr" rid="L2014">Luthra, 2014</xref>; <xref ref-type="bibr"
                     rid="TMTT2018">The Music Therapy Trust, 2018</xref>). This program is now
                  offered in academic collaboration with St. Mira’s College for Girls, Pune, with an
                  examiner from Anglia Ruskin University, UK, charged with assessing the final case
                  study presentations and vivas necessary for program completion.</p>
               <p>Luthra had approximately three and a half years of experience as a music therapist
                  at the time of this interview and has worked as a “Clinical Music Therapy
                  Consultant” in a variety of settings with diverse populations, including mental
                  health, neurological rehabilitation, and clinical hospitals as well as with
                  children with special needs, children with cancer, and the elderly (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22,
                     2018).</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
         </sec>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 end -->
      </sec>
      <!-- sec lvl 2 end -->
      <!-- sec lvl 2 begin -->
      <sec>
         <title>Present</title>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 begin -->
         <sec>
            <title>Music in India</title>
            <p>Music continues to play a vital role in India. As Prof. Dr. Sundar shares, “ Music is
               spiritual and religious and ritualistic in nature apart from being a socio-cultural
               experience, a medium of prayer to seek health from god…music and chanting are tools
               to meditate and relax and to keep one’s body, mind, and the soul in a balanced
               manner” (S. Sundar, personal communication,
                  October 23, 2018). In order to keep this balance, Luthra stated that music
               “is as important as a cup of morning tea in every Indian individual’s life. Everyone
               is grown with some sort of lullabies and melodies, so it is an important part of
               everyone’s life” (A. Luthra, personal
                  communication, October 22, 2018).</p>
            <p>Classical music, in which both Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra are trained, is considered
               serious and refined art music in India, much like European classical music. Both
               Indian and European classical music also have sacred roots, with Indian classical
               music being based upon ancient scriptures. Indian classical music comes from oral
               traditions, with Hindustani being more prominent in North India and Carnatic
               primarily found in South India. As Swamy (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017"
                  >2017</xref>) explained, “Both forms involve lengthy and complex improvisations …
               based on an ancient system of raga, rasa, and tala, focusing on text, melody, rhythm,
               and improvisation” (p. 81). Raga, the primary melodic focus of Indian music (<xref
                  ref-type="bibr" rid="RR2014">Rao &amp; Rao, 2014</xref>), is “a unique melodic
               motif with a specific ascending and descending scale pattern … expressed through
               microtones, melismas, and ornamental slides” (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017"
                  >Swamy, 2017, p. 81</xref>). Ragas are usually associated with certain seasons,
               times of day, deities, and even colors (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="RR2014">Rao &amp;
                  Rao, 2014</xref>; <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017</xref>). Ragas are
               also associated with specific rasas. Rasa means “flavor” and signifies a specific
               emotional state inspired by the raga. The tala is the specific rhythmic pattern or
               framework that is repeated cyclically throughout the raga (<xref ref-type="bibr"
                  rid="RR2014">Rao &amp; Rao, 2014</xref>; <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">Swamy,
                  2017</xref>). While (as noted above) some ragas are believed to enhance mood and
               health, the main focus of Indian classical music is on “aesthetic appreciation,
               scholarship, spiritual growth, healing, and maintaining and preserving cultural
               values” (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017, p. 81</xref>).</p>
         </sec>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 end -->
         <!-- sec lvl 3 begin -->
         <sec>
            <title>Music Therapy in India</title>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Education</title>
               <p>Because Prof. Dr. Sundar’s own music therapy education was so challenging, she
                  felt that it was important to develop a training program that would provide a
                  “structured learning environment” (S. Sundar,
                     personal communication, October 23, 2018) for anyone in India who wanted
                  to delve into the complexities of music therapy. She is now Director of the
                  Chennai School of Music Therapy and leads their Postgraduate Diploma training
                  program in collaboration with the IMC University of Applied Sciences in Krems,
                  Austria. She also directs the Postgraduate Diploma in Music Therapy, the Master of
                  Science in Medical Music Therapy, and the Ph.D. program in Music Therapy for the
                  Centre for Music Therapy Education and Research at Mahatma Gandhi Medical College
                  and Research Institute of Sri Balaji Vidyapeeth University in Pondicherry, India
                  (LinkedIn, n.d.). As she shared,</p>
               <disp-quote>
                  <p>I train most of the music therapists in India and the training is my
                     understanding of music therapy making a differentiation between healing and
                     therapy and how it is important to integrate culture and healing traditions
                     reviewing the traditional practices in physiological, social, psychological,
                     spiritual, and chronological perspectives. This training includes an innovative
                     course (module) on Traditional Healing Practices wherein the students learn
                     about healing practices and know to integrate them in practice with scientific
                     endorsement. (S. Sundar, personal
                        communication, October 23, 2018).</p>
               </disp-quote>
               <p>Because Luthra did not receive her training from Prof. Dr. Sundar, it was
                  particularly interesting to compare and contrast their experiences and
                  understandings of music therapy. As is true for music therapists across the globe,
                  philosophies of and clinical practices in music therapy are influenced by many
                  factors, including the theoretical orientation of and experiences music therapists
                  have in the places where they are trained.</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Theoretical Orientations, Methods, and Instruments</title>
               <p>Luthra noted that she practices from a community music therapy and
                  culturally-centered music therapy perspective. She focused on culturally-centered
                  clinical music therapy for her dissertation, which she describes as using “the
                  clinical process with their culture of using music” (<xref ref-type="bibr"
                     rid="L2014">Luthra, 2014, p. 32</xref>).</p>
               <p>While Prof. Dr. Sundar’s training and work have a more medical and scientific
                  foundation, a natural result of her own education, she still supports using a
                  “spiritually and culturally sensitive model” (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="SM2013"
                     >Sundar &amp; Millett, 2013, p. 3</xref>) of music therapy and trains her
                  students to be “client-centered” (S. Sundar,
                     personal communication, October 23, 2018). Luthra (<xref ref-type="bibr"
                     rid="L2014">2014</xref>) also affirmed that “clinical music therapy believes
                  in a client-centered approach” (p. 34) in India. In addition, Prof. Dr. Sundar
                  stated that, despite the deep religious roots that music has in India, in her
                  training program, “all music therapists are trained to be secular in practice”
                     (S. Sundar, personal communication, October
                     23, 2018).</p>
               <p>As far as what the practice of music therapy in India actually looks like, it
                  appears that receptive listening experiences were most commonly used in the past
                     (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2014">Sundar, 2014</xref>). However, the
                  development of training programs and more advanced clinical practices have
                  resulted in more diverse methods now being used (S. Sundar, personal communication, October 23, 2018).
                  Prof. Dr. Sundar most commonly includes “raga improvisation, with and without
                  imagery, chanting, playing musical instruments, interactive singing and listening
                  experiences, and songwriting” (S. Sundar,
                     personal communication, October 23, 2018). Luthra described using
                  “improvisation in playing instruments…holding, extension, dialoguing, matching,
                  mirroring, imitating, copying, accompanying, turn-taking, silence, singing for
                  joy, receptive interventions, and singing therapy” (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22, 2018).</p>
               <p>Prof. Dr. Sundar continues to use her voice as her primary instrument, as she is a
                  vocalist and Indian classical music tends to be centered around the voice (S. Sundar, personal communication, October 23,
                     2018). Luthra also uses her voice as her primary instrument, although
                  she states that “guitar and xylophones are the easiest to grab attention with” and
                  “instruments like metallophones, tublophones, ektaras, djembes, keyboards, bells,
                  and small percussion are always useful” (A.
                     Luthra, personal communication, October 22, 2018) when working with
                  individuals with different needs.</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Populations, Settings, and Cultures</title>
               <p>Luthra perceives that much of the focus in India has traditionally been on music
                  therapy for individuals with learning disabilities. However, Luthra’s diverse
                  clinical experiences described above demonstrate that music therapy is now
                  implemented in a broader range of settings, including prisons and even armies, and
                  is being used to address a wide range of challenges, including substance use,
                  mental health disorders, and various types of disabilities. Music therapy is even
                  being used for “woman empowerment,” civil services, and general wellbeing (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22,
                     2018). Luthra further stated in her dissertation that “it is for anyone
                  and everyone” (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="L2014">Luthra, 2014</xref>).</p>
               <p>Luthra also affirmed that the answer to every music therapy question is the same
                  in India as it is in the United States, “It depends!” Or, as Luthra more
                  specifically stated, “It absolutely depends on the client’s age and needs” (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22,
                     2018) and as Prof. Dr. Sundar confirmed, “All methods are used with all
                  the clients depending on the context and their needs” (S. Sundar, personal communication, October 23, 2018).</p>
               <p>This is particularly true when working with clients who may speak a different
                  dialect or language, who may come from a different religious background, or who
                  may come from a different caste or other cultural group than you. “India is a very
                  culturally diverse country. To work with diversity, it is really important to be
                  open-minded personally. Acceptability and an urge to learn keeps you going in this
                  country” (A. Luthra, personal communication,
                     October 22, 2018). Or, as she described in her dissertation on
                  culturally-centered clinical music therapy, “Here everything is tied up with the
                  cultural knot” (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="L2014">Luthra, 2014, p. 35</xref>).</p>
               <p>Prof. Dr. Sundar details how she works with students who speak a variety of
                  languages and dialects and who represent a variety of cultures as well as how
                  multicultural competency is taught as part of their music therapy training in
                  India. In fact, her students are taught to</p>
               <disp-quote>
                  <p>record the musical profile which takes into consideration factors like music
                     liking, music listening patterns, music training, family music traditions,
                     community music traditions, and musical preferences and accordingly the musical
                     experiences are chosen…. Music therapists are trained to use musical experience
                     always within the music cultural profile of the patient/client with whom we
                     work and so we use all methods as I said earlier according to the patient’s
                     cultural orientations. (S. Sundar, personal
                        communication, October 23, 2018).</p>
               </disp-quote>
               <p>Luthra (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="L2014">2014</xref>) describes this as the
                  “clinical perspective under cultural influence” (p. 35).</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Personal Uses of Music</title>
               <p>Both Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra have past experience as performers. Prof. Dr.
                  Sundar currently sings a variety of genres of music for her students as part of
                  her teaching and for recordings as part of her music therapy research. In
                  addition, Prof. Dr. Sundar shares that she also sings a lot to her grandchildren
                     (S. Sundar, personal communication, October
                     23, 2018). Luthra, on the other hand, prefers no music in her personal
                  space and stated that she climbs the Himalayas for her own self-care (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22,
                     2018).</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
         </sec>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 end -->
      </sec>
      <!-- sec lvl 2 end -->
      <!-- sec lvl 2 begin -->
      <sec>
         <title>Future</title>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 begin -->
         <sec>
            <title>Music Therapy in India</title>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Challenges</title>
               <p>Both Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra expressed concerns about the growth of music
                  therapy in India, with Luthra ascribing part of the challenge to the fact that
                  musicians are paid so much more than music therapists are (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22, 2018). In
                  addition, Prof. Dr. Sundar believes that part of the delay in advancing music
                  therapy as a profession is actually because of how embedded the music of India is
                  as a traditional healing practice and a lack of understanding in how this is
                  differentiated from music therapy.</p>
               <p>Bringing awareness to the difference between music for healing and music therapy
                  is one of the challenges that Prof. Dr. Sundar has faced in building her training
                  programs. As she stated, “Healing practices have to be integrated into music
                  therapy practice, education, and research with a scientific inquiry in mind. This
                  is an ongoing challenge. What I have been able to reach is the tip of the iceberg”
                     (S. Sundar, personal communication, October
                     23, 2018).</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Hope</title>
               <p>On the other hand, this embedded understanding of the healing power of music can
                  also help medical professionals more easily see the potential for the work music
                  therapists can do and can be “comforting” to those who might be concerned about
                  treatment or “afraid to even visit a doctor” (
                     A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22, 2018). As Prof. Dr.
                  Sundar stated,</p>
               <disp-quote>
                  <p>Healing is only an art. Music therapy is both an art and a science. The science
                     side of music therapy is the same throughout the globe. It is only the art side
                     where music therapy becomes different in India as many healing traditions are
                     integrated in an evidence-based manner. (S.
                        Sundar, personal communication, October 23, 2018).</p>
               </disp-quote>
               <p>She emphasized the potential for music therapy to develop as the “perfect balance”
                  between both the art and the science (S.
                     Sundar, personal communication, October 23, 2018).</p>
               <p>The art side is often found in qualitative resources like audio and video
                  documentation and interviews with the patients and their caretakers that can
                  positively influence and inform future clinical practice. In order to maximize the
                  potential of the science side, Prof. Dr. Sundar also strongly encourages
                  quantitative research which will hopefully lead to music therapy being referred as
                  part of regular medical care in India. She is starting to see the results of all
                  of her efforts. As she shared,</p>
               <disp-quote>
                  <p>In 2013 the medical school ‘Sri Balaji Vidyapeeth’ invited me to develop music
                     medicine and music therapy clinical practice, education, and research as a part
                     of regular medical care with a salutogenic focus. What else can be more
                     rewarding to me? Nothing.” (S. Sundar,
                        personal communication, October 23, 2018)</p>
               </disp-quote>
               <p>Luthra is also excited by the diverse dimensions of music therapy and the
                  multitude of potential areas in which to work, described in some detail above
                     (A. Luthra, personal communication, October
                     22, 2018). After my conversations with both Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra,
                  I am excited, too – by the work that both of them are doing in India, by the
                  growth I see happening in our field in both their country and around the globe,
                  and by the ways that further conversations and collaborations such as those
                  inspired by this publication can enhance that growth.</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
            <!-- sec lvl 4 begin -->
            <sec>
               <title>Resources and Final Thoughts</title>
               <p>As music therapists seek to be more culturally and globally aware, it is important
                  to have resources that we can access and trust.</p>
               <p>Dr. Sangeeta Swamy’s chapter in the Whitehead-Pleaux and Tan (<xref
                     ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">2017</xref>) book entitled <italic>Cultural
                     Intersections in Music Therapy </italic>is a helpful resource for those working
                  with any South Asian clients<italic>. </italic>Swamy has also developed and
                  researched culturally centered music and imagery (or CCMI) with Indian adults
                     (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2011">2011</xref>), which takes into account
                  cultural factors such as “religion, caste, class, regional identity, and personal
                  musical preferences” (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017, p.
                  65</xref>), as well as an “ethnic identity assessment” (<xref ref-type="bibr"
                     rid="S2017">Swamy, 2017, p. 66</xref>). Luthra’s (<xref ref-type="bibr"
                     rid="L2014">2014</xref>) dissertation is an interesting source for both case
                  studies and another perspective on culturally-centered clinical music therapy. In
                  this, she references Stige’s (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2002">2002</xref>)
                  text on <italic>Culture-Centered Music Therapy, </italic>a foundational resource
                  for every music therapist striving to understand the impact of the complex and
                  always-evolving cultural identities of both therapists and clients on current and
                  future clinical practice, theory, and research.</p>
               <p>Prof. Dr. Sundar also has a wealth of knowledge available through her many
                  research articles. I have shared a few of these in the references below but would
                  also suggest you search for her articles on ResearchGate.net. Of course, the World
                  Federation of Music Therapy (WFMT) is also a valuable resource, and the links to
                  the 2013 and 2019 fact pages on India are included in the reference list.</p>
               <p>Both Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra encouraged me to visit India, and I sincerely do
                  hope to do so one day. I am grateful to both Prof. Dr. Sundar and Luthra, as well
                  as to Dr. Swamy, for sharing their experiences and wisdom – and their joy – with
                  me. As Luthra reminds us, “Sharing joy and happiness is across cultures” (A. Luthra, personal communication, October 22,
                     2018).</p>
            </sec>
            <!-- sec lvl 4 end -->
         </sec>
         <!-- sec lvl 3 end -->
      </sec>
      <!-- sec lvl 2 end -->
      <!-- sec lvl 2 begin -->
      <sec>
         <title>Acknowledgements</title>
         <p>I am truly grateful to Dr. Annie Heiderscheit for introducing me to Prof. Dr. Sundar and
            for advising me on this submission process, as well as for assigning the original
            interview that inspired this paper. Many thanks also to Anurati Jain for connecting me
            with Aastha Luthra. It was my honor to conduct interviews with both Prof. Dr. Sumathy
            Sundar and Aastha Luthra, and I am grateful for the opportunity they gave me to share
            with you at least two different perspectives on the past, present, and future of music
            therapy in this very diverse country. I would also like to thank Prof. Dr. Sundar for
            encouraging me to submit this interview for publication. In addition, it has been my
            privilege to discuss the role of music and music therapy in India with Dr. Sangeeta
            Swamy over the past few years. The knowledge and wisdom I gained from these interactions
            with Swamy along with the information from Swamy’s (<xref ref-type="bibr" rid="S2017"
               >2017</xref>) chapter of the Whitehead-Pleaux and Tan (<xref ref-type="bibr"
               rid="S2017">2017</xref>) book helped to widen the lens through which I conducted
            and now share these interviews. Finally, I would like to express my deep gratitude to
            the many family members, friends, colleagues, students, and clients who have shared
            their perspectives with me, helping me to better understand the myriad of ways our
            intersectional identities affect our lives and interactions. I look forward to
            continuing to learn with and from you all!</p>
      </sec>
      <!-- sec lvl 2 end -->
      <!-- sec lvl 2 begin -->
      <sec>
         <title>Author the author</title>
         <p>Jennifer Hicks is a board-certified music therapist, a licensed music educator, an
            experienced registered yoga teacher, the owner of Joyful Noises LLC, and the director of
            an American Music Therapy Association (AMTA) national roster internship site. Her
            mission is to utilize music therapy and mindfulness principles to inspire and empower
            others to experience and create joy in their lives, regardless of circumstances, age, or
            ability level. Jennifer is currently Co-Chair of the AMTA Commission on the Education
            and Clinical Training of 21st Century Music Therapists, Co-Chair for the AMTA Membership
            Committee, and recently served as Local Committee Co-Chair for the 2019 AMTA National
            Conference. She received the Music Therapy Association of Minnesota’s 2018 Service Award
            and is a frequent presenter at local, regional, and national conferences.</p>
      </sec>
      <!-- sec lvl 2 end -->
   </body>
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